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rickmastfan67
Joined: 14 Jul 2008
Posts: 2031
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
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 Posted: Wed May 13, 2009 1:27 pm Post subject: NC: I-74_S; partially returned to being a Future Interstate. |
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I just took a day trip down to Launisburg, NC to check out this new section of I-74 for myself. And to my surprise, all of the new exit numbers are now up to replace the old incorrect ones.
Here are the following changes for the exit numbers (the I-74(*) numbers will also needed to be added to the US-74 NC file for each exit, as well as for US-501):
US74_W > 181
NC79 > 182
US15/401 > 183
US15Bus > 184
US501 > 185
HigRd > 186
US74Bus > 187
AirRd > 190
NC71/130 > 191
US74Alt > 194
CabShopRd > 197
NC710 > 200
.....
Also, I think we should add a 214 point to end I-74_S. The 213 MM is almost right in the middle of the #213 Exit. And the I-74 End sign is posted right @ the 214 MM which I would say a good 1/2 mile from the end of the exit ramps going EB. So, I would recommend adding the following point at the end of I-74_S:
214 http://maps.google.com/?ll=34.575615,-79.04069&spn=0.017844,0.038624
Don't forget to also add this point to the US-74 file, but I think it can be as a hidden one since there is no way to be able to U-Turn till the next intersection on US-74.
Last edited by rickmastfan67 on Mon Nov 16, 2009 4:19 am; edited 2 times in total |
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rickmastfan67
Joined: 14 Jul 2008
Posts: 2031
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
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| Posted: Wed May 13, 2009 1:40 pm Post subject: |
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dfilpus
Joined: 14 Jul 2008
Posts: 717
Location: Chapel Hill NC
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| Posted: Sun May 17, 2009 6:35 pm Post subject: |
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I'be taken care of US 74, US 501 and US 74 South.
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Dave Filpus
http://roadgeek.filpus.org/ |
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rickmastfan67
Joined: 14 Jul 2008
Posts: 2031
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
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| Posted: Sun May 24, 2009 3:19 am Post subject: |
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I've noticed that this is mentioned on the update page as updated for I-74_S, but it doesn't seem to be yet.
Also Dave, what's your opinion on extending I-74_S to the 214 MM location that I mentioned in the original post? When I was driving back from the first place I could U-Turn on US-74, I did see a "Mile 214" post on the WB side of the highway (sorry, wasn't ready for it and didn't get a picture) right across from the "END I-74" sign on the other side of the highway. And as I said in the original post, this was maybe a good 1/2 Mile from the On/Off ramps on the Eastern side of the NC-41 interchange. If you're already going to be adding the 214 point to I-74_S (and the hidden point to US-74), just ignore my rambling here. lol. |
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dfilpus
Joined: 14 Jul 2008
Posts: 717
Location: Chapel Hill NC
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| Posted: Sun May 24, 2009 7:36 am Post subject: |
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US 74 has been updated but US 74 S hasn't. I did send a updated .ggm.
As far as adding a 214 point goes, the current submitted map does not have it. Is there a precedent for ending an Interstate at a noninterchange? For example, where is the current west end of I 64 in Missouri? We show it ending at exit 9, while the freeway goes for a mile or so beyond that interchange.
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Dave Filpus
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admin
Site Admin
Joined: 13 Jul 2008
Posts: 4053
Location: Maryland
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| Posted: Sun May 24, 2009 12:57 pm Post subject: |
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| It looks like I skipped uploading one of the HB folders that needed to be updated. I can fix it on Tuesday. I-74S looks good in the new HB though. |
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rickmastfan67
Joined: 14 Jul 2008
Posts: 2031
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
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| Posted: Sun May 24, 2009 11:00 pm Post subject: |
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| dfilpus wrote: | | Is there a precedent for ending an Interstate at a noninterchange? For example, where is the current west end of I 64 in Missouri? We show it ending at exit 9, while the freeway goes for a mile or so beyond that interchange. |
Well, we have done several that don't end @ interchanges and end at a traffic light controlled intersection like SC I-185. *But I did extend ON-400 and ON-417 past their last interchanges to their true ends if you want to see where it's been done before.*
But we also don't normally get Interstates going past an Interchange and ending into another route that uses different MM's. Because going EB when I/US-74 transitions into just US-74, they have a US-74 MM posted just right before the END I-74 shield. But going WB, there is no BEGIN I-74, but the MM's change from US-74's 300+ MM's to I-74's 214MM a good distance before the 213 exit.
Now, the only reason I can think why NCDOT 'extended' I-74 past the interchange to the 214MM is because in the future, the segment of US-74 is going to be upgraded to Interstate standards. Because right @ the I-74 END / 214MM, the shoulders change their width right there. So you can really tell that is the true end of I-74 there. That and the newer pavement color.
So Tim, do you agree with the extension of I-74_S to the 214 MM? I mean, you could say it's similar to the temporary end of I-99 (well, it was a future Interstate at that time) up at SkyTop. You do have that point on the I-99 file. Heck, we could always hide the 214 point on I-74 once it's extended. That should work for everybody. But that might not happen for a few years. |
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admin
Site Admin
Joined: 13 Jul 2008
Posts: 4053
Location: Maryland
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| Posted: Mon May 25, 2009 10:12 pm Post subject: |
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I wish I had a good updated map to see exactly what's going on with the I-74 end. Everything I can dig up on the web shows it u/c and incomplete.
A few notes/reminders, in hopes they are helpful anyway:
- We're using the rule of thumb of "one waypoint per interchange/junction/intersection". This means that freeways ending at interchanges will nearly always have some ramps extending a little past our waypoint. If the mainline continues as another designation (see FL I-295 & FL 9A for example), it may seem like we miss some further mileage that doesn't end at a junction. But this is simply the accuracy level of the project.
- Some Interstates don't end at interchanges, but they do end at intersections of some sort. The example of the I-99 north end is like this now, ending clearly north of Exit 83 but before the I-80 interchange. In this case I think there is both compelling evidence to mark the end where I have and a significant mainline portion included beyond Exit 83.
- If the end of I-74 isn't Exit 214 as an interchange, nor the rare case of being signed as an Exit at an at-grade intersection, then you wouldn't label it as "214", but you'd use the crossroad name in abbreviated form. Is there a cross road? Alt or Bus US 74 or NC 41?
- The ON 400, ON 417, TN I-124, and PA I-276 ends annoy me. To have the designation end at a non-junction seems silly to me. But that's not up to us to change, so we just mimic what the official word is. |
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rickmastfan67
Joined: 14 Jul 2008
Posts: 2031
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
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| Posted: Tue May 26, 2009 1:35 am Post subject: |
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| admin wrote: | | - If the end of I-74 isn't Exit 214 as an interchange, nor the rare case of being signed as an Exit at an at-grade intersection, then you wouldn't label it as "214", but you'd use the crossroad name in abbreviated form. Is there a cross road? Alt or Bus US 74 or NC 41? |
There is no crossroad at all Tim where I-74_S ends right now. When I was there, (You can see some of my pictures here), the 213MM for I-74 is a little bit right past the Exit 213 Gore sign going EB and pretty much right in the middle of the interchange. I've circled the MM in the picture below and also included the close up of that MM that I took.
Now, here's my picture of the END I-74 shield complete with the first US-74 MM of 364 going EB. You can clearly see in this shot the changing of the highway from the Interstate standards to non-Interstate standards with the reduction of the width of the shoulder.
Now going WB, directly across from the END I-74 sign, there is a 214MM showing the start of I-74. Unfortunately, I wasn't able to get a shot of this MM. And StreetView only shows the area as U/C. But using StreetView as an aid, you can easily find the end of I-74 by the end of the construction zone. In the picture above, you can see the edge of the Speed Limit 60 sign. Here's it's location in streetview. When you zoom out as well, you can clearly see the distance between the end of the exit ramps and where I-74 ends. This is why I feel like we should extend I-74 to the 214 point I provided in the original post in this thread.
| admin wrote: | | - The ON 400, ON 417, TN I-124, and PA I-276 ends annoy me. To have the designation end at a non-junction seems silly to me. But that's not up to us to change, so we just mimic what the official word is. |
You should also add US-319 in FL to that list. lol. |
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admin
Site Admin
Joined: 13 Jul 2008
Posts: 4053
Location: Maryland
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| Posted: Tue May 26, 2009 11:09 am Post subject: |
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| What I see is that the END sign is at the end of the Exit 213 ramp, which must be a mile from NC 41. The next crossroad is at Old Kingsdale Road, but that's even farther away. So I'd just leave the end at Exit 213. |
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admin
Site Admin
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Posts: 4053
Location: Maryland
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| Posted: Tue May 26, 2009 11:16 pm Post subject: |
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| The supposed-to-be-updated I-74_S will be uploaded overnight. I'm actually uploading the entire old HB in case I've forgotten to upload any former changes. |
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rickmastfan67
Joined: 14 Jul 2008
Posts: 2031
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
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| Posted: Mon Nov 16, 2009 4:18 am Post subject: |
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I hate to revive this thread, but something major has happened to I-74_S. All signs for I-74 (except BGS's for now) have been removed West of Exit #194. That section has been turned back to being a "Future" Interstate... 
http://surewhynotnow.blogspot.com/2009/11/laurinburg-maxton-bypass-once-and.html
So, we now need a new Future I-74 for Exits #181-194. The I-74_S now will only have #194-#213.
As for the bringing back of the old labels for the section that signs were removed on for US-74/501's file, I would think we should do something new this time. Instead of replacing them with the old road name labels, how about something like this: FI-74(181)? This is only because they did have the true I-74 shields up along that section of the highway.
Also, I would recommend that the points for 191 and 194 be recentered on the roads. That and a shaping point added between 203 and 207.  |
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dfilpus
Joined: 14 Jul 2008
Posts: 717
Location: Chapel Hill NC
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| Posted: Mon Nov 16, 2009 11:01 am Post subject: |
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| rickmastfan67 wrote: | I hate to revive this thread, but something major has happened to I-74_S. All signs for I-74 (except BGS's for now) have been removed West of Exit #194. That section has been turned back to being a "Future" Interstate...
http://surewhynotnow.blogspot.com/2009/11/laurinburg-maxton-bypass-once-and.html
So, we now need a new Future I-74 for Exits #181-194. The I-74_S now will only have #194-#213.
As for the bringing back of the old labels for the section that signs were removed on for US-74/501's file, I would think we should do something new this time. Instead of replacing them with the old road name labels, how about something like this: FI-74(181)? This is only because they did have the true I-74 shields up along that section of the highway.
Also, I would recommend that the points for 191 and 194 be recentered on the roads. That and a shaping point added between 203 and 207. |
I was waiting for Adam's report before bringing this us here.
I second using the FI-74 exit labels for the US and NC highway maps being affected. The exits are still numbered with I 74 numbers, until NCDOT decides to renumber them yet again with US 74 numbers.
This change also affects US 15 and 401, Business US 15. 401 and 501 and NC 71 and 79.
As far as recentering points goes, the latest update to Google maps has caused points to be miscentered all over the country. There are thousands of misaligned points in Ohio alone.
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Dave Filpus
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admin
Site Admin
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Location: Maryland
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| Posted: Mon Nov 16, 2009 3:19 pm Post subject: |
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FI-74() labels would be fine for the concurrent routes.
Let's also take the opportunity to change I-74_S to I-74+city suffix. Pem for Pembroke or Lum for Lumberton? Also, with this, there is probably no need to keep hidden versions of the old points.
You say Google's data shifted. Is Yahoo/NAVTEQ's still intact? |
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rickmastfan67
Joined: 14 Jul 2008
Posts: 2031
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
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| Posted: Mon Nov 16, 2009 8:17 pm Post subject: |
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| admin wrote: | | You say Google's data shifted. Is Yahoo/NAVTEQ's still intact? |
Well, with the Google data, it matches with the Sat Images they have perfectly along this section of highway. Plus, Yahoo doesn't even have any part of I-74 in that area except the old bypasses.
And with point 194, it was more centered on the old US-74/US-74Bus intersection point instead of the new interchange. |
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